Illegal Immigration: Should we deport all illegal immigrants we find in the U.S. (2)

==dIllegal Immigration: Should we deport all illegal immigrants we find in the U.S. - 11/20/2007 (https://www.debate.org/debates/Illegal-Immigration-Should-we-deport-all-illegal-immigrants-we-find-in-the-US/2/)==

Round 1
Harlan: "Hello, I am sorry that I was too busy to reply previously. Please allow this debate to continue, by accepting my challenge to start it again from where we left off. To the spectators, this is the continuation of a debate that was forfeited due to lack of time. Please vote based on that debate also. For reference it is here:

http://www.debate.org...

When I said that they "benefit society more than they damage it" I was referring to what would happen if they were not here. Your account of 16 billion a year was ignoring the jobs and services they fill all across this nation. Financially, they probably do more damage, but when discussing "society" it is referring to a lot of things.

If all of the illegal immigrants that make up 5% of the American population were gone tomorrow, accordingly about 5% of jobs would be left empty tomorrow. All of these niches would be UNFULFILLED. It is important that we not just send them all away. In fact, you admit this yourself by claiming that there is a problem because they take a lot of jobs from Americans. On the subject: You back up your argument by saying "the illegal immigrants our taking jobs from our impoverished that would love the job". Anytime that anyone EVER takes a job, they are destroying the hypothetical opportunity for another to have that job. These immigrants came here for a reason. They came here to make money because where they came from they were surrounded by poverty. They deserve those jobs, just as much as the next "impoverished" guy. Most illegal immigrants are certainly in poverty.

A problem with your solution that I would like to throw out now, is this: A large amount of illegal immigrants come here and then have children. These children are natural citizens. Tell me: Would you only deport the parents, leaving the children to be orphans, or would you deport the children too, who never broke any laws, are natural citizens, and who you would be putting them in a state of poverty? This is only one of many examples of the various complexities of a project of this magnitude and impact.

Please see comments forum to read the rest of this argument. I may not post the rest of it until republicanview accepts the challenge, allowing comments to be posted. I will post rest of this argument which has become to large for limit of length in the comments forum chronological order."

RepublicanView333: "Hello Harlan,

you continue to say that immigrants are a important part of our society but I keep showing you its not true.

I'll go back to what I said in our last debate "13% of our citizens are impoverished" If we can successfully deport all immigrants and establish the impoverished into the jobs the illegals took successfully we could cut our poverty rate in half.

You say that when ever someone gets a job they destroy the oppurtunity for someone else to get a job. This is true, but these illegal immigrants take jobs from legal citizens who are at position in life that the mexicans were before they came here. Which isn't fair. I know nothing in life is fair because in everything someone gets screwed but this really isn't fair. The illegals trying to escape there povery but in doing so they put another person in it. that person is a legal citizen who was born here or went through the "tough" legalization progress to get here. That really isn't fair. We would still be getting our goods and our poverty rate would go down.

Now you say that the specifics of your perposal to make legaliuzation easier are important. For each thing that changes, there will be a effect on specific society. but you did give me one specific. Reducing prolonged periods of pending. Well, why not just reduce the amount of time we take for making someone a citizen. Well, what could possibly go wrong. Well, im sorrry to say many things. There are specific reasons for the prolong pendng. One I'm aware of is to regulate the amount of immigrants coming in the country at a time. if we make it a specific time for a person to get memberships we would have massive amounts of immigrants coming into country throughout the year. This would be bad. There would be even more poverty and eventually there would be population problems in our big cities. Also, if we reduced the prolonged pending the our workers would be overworked trying to make theses people citizens in the specifiated time. the workers who already work so hard to make sure that these people aren't terrorists or bad people entering our country. They have to run backround checks, give them tests to see if there eligable and grade those tests. In 2005 14.9 million people were naturalized, thats 41, 096 people entering our country a day. Giving the people who do this a deadline will only tire them out, and make them overrun potentually dangerous things.

Im sorry Harlan Ive seen to run outof space rest will be in next res."

Round 2
Harlan: "Hello, and happy thanksgiving to you all!

You said: "you continue to say that immigrants are a important part of our society but I keep showing you its not true"

Allright, we are obiously not on the same page.

Definitions of society:

"a voluntary association of individuals for common ends; especially : an organized group working together or periodically meeting because of common interests, beliefs, or profession" - Merriam-websters.com

They have PROFESSIONS that serve the needs of other Americans, so they are part of society.

"an enduring and cooperating social group whose members have developed organized patterns of relationships through interaction with one another" -Merriam-websters.com

They INTERACT with Americans, so they are part of society.

"a natural group of plants usually of a single species or habit within an association" -merriam-websters.com They are plants, so they are a society. Wait…never mind. That one doesn't work. 8?)

Putting that aside, you continuously complain that 13% of "our" citizens are impoverished. Would you like to know the figures for Mexico? Here they are:

In the year 2002, half the population of Mexico was in poverty, and 1/5 of the population was in extreme poverty. In 2002, access to sanitation was recorded as 80%, only 4/5 of the population.

As of 2002, 4% to 9% of people in Mexico lived on less than one dollar a day.

Mexico is just one example. Countries such as Guatemala, are probably even worse.

"The illegals trying to escape there povery but in doing so they put another person in it"

You need to treat illegal immigrants as your equals. What would REALLY be putting someone in poverty is if you deported 13 million people into countries SURROUNDED by "povery". There are plenty of jobs in America. I feel bad for those people that are impoverished and live in America. The reason they are impoverished has almost nothing to do with illegal immigration. 40% of those in poverty are children. These children are obviously not looking for jobs. The reasons for being in poverty are often linked primarily to lack of affordable housing, or addictions to drugs or alcohol. Your solution would not cut the poverty rate in half.

We are here to debate:

"Illegal Immigration: Should we deport all illegal immigrants we find in the U.S." Let's please not get off track, republican view. I was only proposing that we try to reduce this time. We could use better systems for doing it. Specifics of another solution are not important, when we are discussing your solution. My solution is that we put effort into making the illegal immigrants into citizens. That is basically what I am arguing towards."

RepublicanView333: "Hello Harlan happy thanksgiving to you and everyone else,

for your solution we would only be making future immigrants easier to be citizens. It won't eliminate all the aliens in our borders now. So until you clarify i'll debate your solution now.

yes, according to your definition illegals arte part of our "society", but, that still doesn't make them legal. The point of my statements are they got here illegally. They work here illegally taking money from our pockets everytime there anchor children go to school, everytime they go to the hospital, everytime one gets sent to jail. Its taken from our tax dollars. In all they cost us 789,263,000,000 billion dollars. To see the total breakdown of the costs go to our last debate. If we make them citizens that money won't go away. They will be paying taxes but that money will still be gone. We will still be teaching there spanish speaking children, our resturants will be still making spanish menus, Weare still waiting for the operator to finish saying "press to for spanish, they will still be latinoizing our culture.

This is similar to some comments in the last debate but I wanted to say this. Go to a wal-mart. Buy a...stick of gum and go to the cash registor. Look at the ethnicity of the cashier. Maybe it won't be but up here in Connecticut it is true everytime. Every cashier is latino. And this isn't racist or bigotry. Its true for the McDonalds and Home Depot true. I'm not saying they are all illegals but i'm possitive 1 out of all 3 are. Now i try to buy my gum and even if there not illegal they speak spanish or "spanglish" Now once in a while I will get a person who is alright but its true. Illegal or not Latinos are changing our culture. Don't call me racist because my best friend is a Latino immigrant. But I have ultimate respect for him because him and his family came here the legal way. That wasn't very intelecual but It is a anecdote how the Latinos are changing our culture.

Yes, we are the "immigration nation" but we have to stop the illegals from changing our culture. Its the Mexicans culture that made them impoverished and unless we deport! them are culture will be overpowered by there mexican one.

I never said it was the illegals fault they were impoverished but it was the illegals fault they are having all the trouble getting out.

"Illegal aliens displaced American workers at a cost in excess of $133 billion dollars last year according to Harvard Professor George Borjas."

The how many of the impoverished childs are in a impoverished family? If those parents can get a job the illegals who are deported leave then that would help the family (including the child) get out of poverty. Why is there illaffordable housing? the debt illegals give us. umm...789,263,000,000 billion dollars. Simple equation. illegal immigrant debt goes up, stock market goes down, poverty goes up.

Do you fix a problem by running away from it? That is why the illegals have to stay in Mexico and help rebuild there country instead of ruining ours. Look at Bill Clinton (im not a supporter but it is a good story) he grew up in a trailer park. He grew up to be the 42 president. He fought through money problems to become a success. Why can't the Mexicans do that.

"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has." Margret Mead

Why can't that be true with the Mexicans? If the founding fathers thought it was to hard to beat britian and given up we wouldn't be here right now. You have to fight throughhard times and preserver. It would be doing the Mexicans a favor sending them back to there country. A little tough love never hurt. fix your country don't do what you did to your country to ours."

Round 3
Harlan: "Hello, republican view. It appears that you are avoiding many of my points, and we are also getting off topic. In the next round, please look back at the opening argument and answer each point in turn. I originally excused this for you're not having any space left over. I was relying on the fact that you would answer each point more fully in the following round. You failed to do so. I will SHOW you how to answer each point in turn. Nevertheless, here it goes: "for your solution we would only be making future immigrants easier to be citizens. It won't eliminate all the aliens in our borders now. So until you clarify i'll debate your solution now." All right, isn't that the purpose: to make them citizens, if it is easier to become citizens, then maybe they won't break in illegally. And let's be realistic, republicanview; neither of our solutions will "eliminate all the aliens". It's a big country, you can't eliminate "all" of the illegal immigration. We are not here to debate my solution, we are here to debate yours, hence the header.

I am glad that you finally concede that they are a part of our society. "you continue to say that immigrants are a important part of our society but I keep showing you its not true" -your opening argument "illegals arte part of our ‘society'" -Your round one. I am glad that I am shedding some light on the issue for you, and that you are beginning to understand more. You then proceeded to talk about how there are a lot of illegal immigrants. Duh. You are evading my points and changing the subject. You talk about them changing our culture. You then reverted back to explaining what a big problem illegal immigration is. WE have already established that I agree that it is a problem, and it is the solution we are here debating. "If we make them citizens that money won't go away. They will be paying taxes but that money will still be gone" Do you think through these things before you post them? Neither solution will repay that money. You seem to want to deport them out of vengeance. You were uncomfortable with the inescapable reality I put in your face, so you started changing the subject, and talking about something COMPLETELY unrelated. What does culture have anything to do with this? I fail to see the relevance. There is one relevance that you so badly attempt at giving and that is the Latino culture promotes poverty. Ummm…WHAT?! Could you please try to back up the idea that some particular aspect of Latino culture causes slavery? Mariachi? Cinco de Mayo? Please try to be realistic. Spain shares many cultural aspects, and they are a moderately wealthy European country. You made a random guess of 1/3 of Latinos are immigrants. Random guesses don't serve as backing in a debate, next time, I want a REAL figure. You ignored what I said about the main causes of poverty in America, and for the sake of not repeating myself, go back and read it thoroughly, and really go back and read it this time, republicanview 8?) Not everyone is as childishly idealistic as to make a life-changing decision based on making a country better. WHO CARES? They are in a state of poverty. They move to America to do better. Anyways, I fail to see the relevance of this. You are seriously changing the subject, republicanview. "Illegal Immigration: Should we deport all illegal immigrants we find in the U.S."

Stay on task, this is really frustrating."

RepublicanView333: "Hey, Harlan, Sorry 4 not rsponding immediatly in my next round about your issues. Slipped my mind. Now about your statement about our ways to crackdown on illegal immigration. Yes, neither of our ways will effiecintly crack down on all immigrants but my way will get the most out of the country will your way will do nothing about the ones already here and make the naturalization numbers skyrocket. To go back to the points I missed in the first round. From your second comment.

"The immigrants that have long established life here would be thrust into poverty. Their children would either be orphaned or also put into poverty. Americans would not get the goods and services that they often enjoy, for a long period due to this mass, forced, mass emigration of 5% of our population"

Yes they have established life but they have done so illegally. They have broke in through our borders and stolen life and money from us. We would still get the services because people who the illegals took jobs from would fill in the job. there foreign born children would be sent back with them. There american anchor babies should be orphaned and when turn 18 be given the choice of going back to there respective countrys or staying like any dual citizen.

To go back to the points you made in your 3rd comment.

"The immigrants get to stay. The citizenship they have dreamed of for so long is within grasp. They get to continue living in America, in relative luxury (relative to their alternative). Children stay with their parents. America gets its goods still. Individuals don't have to pay as much for Medicare. With your solution, everyone loses. With mine, everyone wins. This is simply because of the simple principle that my solution changes as little as possible. No drastic swings or monumental changes are made, that would generally disturb the system on many levels are made..."

Yes, the immigrants get to stay but they are being rewarded for there crime. They broke into our country ILLEGALLY and live here under false pretenses and they cost us $789,263,000,000, they did the crimes of, breaking and entering, and stealing. And for some they trafficed drugs from there homeland, brought in illegal merchandise and more. They deserve prison time. Deporting them is even leanent. Yes, the children shouldn't be punished for there parents crimes but depending on were they were born they should be treated accordingly. We would still get our goods plus more LEGAL americans get jobs. With my solution AMERICA wins. The criminals lose. Thats how america should be run. If you do something bad you get punished not rewarded (with citizenship). I hope that will suffice for closure on my first argument. Yes, I will admit they are part of the society BUT society is different than a country. at my school our teachers call our grade a society. But does that mean that we are a funtioning body with a goverment and a system. No. Look at the show Survivor. While they are there they are a society of people helping each other out to reach a common goal. The point is that any group of people can be called a society. hence your definition:

"a voluntary association of individuals for common ends; especially : an organized group working together or periodically meeting because of common interests, beliefs, or profession" - Merriam-websters.com But they drain our society more with the money they cost us which far outways the work they do which legal Americans can do too.

By my changing the subject I am merrly giving examples of Why we have to deport them. No I don't want to deport them out of vengeance I want to deport them because they DON'T belong here. They take major amounts of money from us and take jobs from us. Thats why I want to deport them. Culture is important. With the high amount of illegals our culture is changing. Instead of English or grammer classes ( something many people on this site including myself needs) in middle and elementary we have spanish. we have to deal with explaining and repeating our senteances when we call for a pizza or for a computer problem (something my parents recently experienced) It is more the reason to deport deport deport. and were did I say latino culture promotes poverty. I am unaware if I did but point it out because its not what i meant to say. My next point of my town with the 1/3 illegal rate was a factual guesstimate. It was a gues on my part it may not be right but it isn't to far off. I will give more factual data next time. Hmmm, drugs and alcohol. yes, alcohol is pretty a problem right from the homeland. but what about drugs? Where do the drugs come from? oh yeah illegals will sometimes smuggle drugs through the border selling them to america. (check my facts in the last debate) Illegals also increase debt in our country via taxes which drops stock market and increases cost on houses.

What is really FRUSTERATING having to tell you the relevance of my reasons for the debate."

Round 4
Harlan: "Hello,

I don't see any reason to get them out of the country just as long as their citizens. It would still solve the problem at hand: illegal immigrants inability to properly pay taxes.

"your way will do nothing about the ones already here"

What? Mine is the one that specifically deals with those who are currently here, turning them into citizens. While yours just throws them out.

"Yes they have established life but they have done so illegally"

Changing the subject...again. I gave a valid logical argument and you basically said "Yes,...but they still broke in illegally" and then started talking about them immigrating illegaly. Politicians do it all the time. I can see through that. It doesn't matter if it was illegal, the point I was making was that Everybody, even the illegal immigrants wins, with my solution. My solution is compromise. Your's is punishment. I will repeat, most homeless people in America are in poverty fro a reasoncompletely unrelated to illegal immigration. You think all of those poor drunkard bums (no, offense, poor drunkard bums) on the street, are suddenly going to get hired because you deported 5% of the people in the US. Of course not.

"there foreign born children would be sent back with them. There american anchor babies should be orphaned and when turn 18 be given the choice of going back to there respective countrys or staying like any dual citizen"

Republicanview, that is horrible. 5%. 5% of the people in the US are the people to whom you would deport. Alot of them have children. That is at least 3 million children you are orphaning.

"the immigrants get to stay but they are being rewarded for there crime." Soon afterward:

"I don't want to deport them out of vengeance"

Right...You want to deport them because you're mad at them amd think they "don't deserve" it, yet you are not deporting them from vengeance. Right. Guess what, life isn't always fair. Sometimes we have to transcend what someone "deserves" and realize what is good for the common welfare. I think everyone "deserves" to have a good life.

Government is for the good of the people. The people make up the society. The immigrants are deported and thus it hurts the society. Government is there to help society.

Sure culture is important, but not in this context. America is supposed to be a MELTING POT, republicanview. We can't suddenly start making it an exclusive club, in which we deport someone because of their culture. That is sick. It is like saying: "WE don't like the foods you eat or the clothes you wear, so...you're gonna have to leave and start life anew in a country surrounded by poverty".

"Its the Mexicans culture that made them impoverished"

Don't flip-flop on me, republicanview. It's what you said.

I missed that you were only specifying your own town. I don't know anything about your town. In austin, Texas, I know lots of hispanics, I don't know any of them to be illegal immigrants. The only person I have known to be an illegal immigrant was from vietnam.

You don't need to convince me that illegal immigration is bad. You continuosly complain about it. You should have maybe made the debate header: "illegal immigration is harmful". You didn't though, and we are debating whether we should deport all illegal immigrants."

RepublicanView333: "Good Day,

I still say that your way isn't going to work about the illegals ALREADY in our country right now. Your solution would only make it easier for those outside the country now to become citizens. It would do nothing to stop the ones already in. That is why mine is the best way to get the illegals OUT and yours is the best way to STOP.

Harlan you keep insisting I'm changing the subject I'm not. I'm agreeing with you that yes they have a life here, which is obvious, if they didn't they would leave. But I'm saying just because they have life here isn't a good reason to allow them all to stay. I will admit...YES!!! Deportion is a PUNISHMENT ITS SUPPOST TO BE!!!!!! They came here illegally they should be punished.

Now let me rephrase something I said that illegals have been a problem with poverty) shortened) After think it it over realistically I want to rephrase that. Illegals are a problem with lowering the poverty rate. With the illegals taking jobs for lower wages the impoverished who need the money at the bare minimum wage arent getting the job. So they aren't even being paid minimunm wage b/c they don't even have the job. So because the illegals have lower standards the illgals take jobs from employers who want to save a buck or 2. Here's a solution to that. AFTER we deport a good majority of illegals we help Mexico set up a system of minimum wage which will ensure the Mexicanos will make more in THERE OWN COUNTRY. Now the employers will be able to hire the impoverished who's legal families really need it, at a true minimum wage or more. Thus helping get impoverished more jobs to lower the poverty rate. Now the drunk ones who are just boozed underacheivers will probably not bother but th etrue impoverished with a family to feed will finally get a job and get back on track.

yes there will be a lot of children orphaned and sent back to Mexico and other sorry countries but it has to be done. The children born on American soil shouldn't get deprived of being Americans based on there parents actions so let them grow up in America. When they turn 18 give them a choice of going back to there homeland or staying like ANY dual citizen. For the ones born in the secondary country bring them back. Yes, they shouldn't be punished for there parents but its what has to be done. If we let the kids stay. orphanages will be fill with little Mexican children.

Yes, I agree with your everyone deserves a good life...IF they earn it. Should a homeless family who is barley making it by be given money so they can have a good life? No the people should take responsibility that they have to work up the latter. That is the Capitolist way. The govermnet doesn't mess with your money but you have to work hard to get that money. the illegals shouldn't get a free pass because of where they come from. First let them become citizens through the right way to first of all be covered by the Constitution that gives CITIZENS the right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. The thing w/ the Constitution is it gives all the rights to CITIZENs not anyone who decides to want to be Americans. You have to work (believe it or not) to have those rights. Then after they become a citizen they can..."pursue Happiness"

Goverment is there to help the Citizens of its society. illegals are people who cost that goverment much more than they provide. As you say if the illegals cost us 789,263,000,000 billion dollars compared to 16,000,000,000 they bring in its the goverments duty to do whats best 4 the people to GET RIDE OF THEM AND DEPORT DEPORT DEPORT!!!

To make a proposal for a solution that..."compromises"

We deport as many illegals as we can lets say clean the lint trap of america. When we have a good majority of illegals out of the U.S. we establish your solution to make becoming a citizen easier. Lets not go overboard to make it easier but still do something so the illegals don't have to resort to breaking in. This way we deal with getting a good amount of illegals out and help prevent future break ins."

Round 5
Harlan: "Hello,

"Your solution would only make it easier for those outside the country now to become citizens"

-Thank you for stating the obvious. That is the point. If it is easier to immigrate in legally, they won't immigrate illegally. This solves the problem.

"It would do nothing to stop the ones already in"

-Stop them from what? It would stop them from continuing to be illegal aliens.

"Deportion is a PUNISHMENT ITS SUPPOST TO BE!!!!!"

-It is deportation, actually. I was aware that what "ITS SUPPOST TO BE!!!!!!" is a solution to the problem of illegal immigrants, not a chance to get revenge. I hardly imagine it necessary to fund a large project, which would hurt society, just for revenge. Why do you need to punish? Despite whether they "should" be punished, we must transcend what people do or do not deserve, republicanview.

"With the illegals taking jobs for lower wages the impoverished who need the money at the bare minimum wage arent getting the job"

Correct…Solution: turn the illegal aliens into citizens so they get payed minimum wage, just like everyone else. Problem solved. Also, they would be Americans, so people like you would not have to complain about them taking jobs from Americans…because they are Americans! Maybe that would make you feel a little better inside.

AS to the thing with the children; there is no getting around it…There will be very, very ugly consequences to doing as you suggest. So many children (my estimate being at about AT LEAST 3 million children based on about 15 million aliens; though it is almost certainly more) would be orphaned. That would truly be horrible.

Everyone "deserves" a good life. Period. That does not mean that we should go out of our way to make sure that everyone gets that. After all, life's not fair, but essentially everyone "deserves" a good life. I never, Never stated that they should be given money or anything.

I never even mentioned the constitution or any civil rights, but you brought it up…A TRUE American would want to share his rights with all. He would work to give others the blessings to which he is secured, for there are certain unalieble rights and that all men are created equal, republicanview. Do you truly understand the philosophies of the constitution, or do you only care of the strictly legal aspect, and ignore the vision to which the founding fathers set forth?

"As you say if the illegals cost us 789,263,000,000 billion dollars compared to 16,000,000,000 they bring in its the goverments duty to do whats best 4 the people to GET RIDE OF THEM AND DEPORT DEPORT DEPORT!!!"

-First of all, I would like to remind you that the term "illegals" is not a real word. My spellcheck apparently agrees with me…. Now, ALL of the problems of illegal immigration you stated their, could EASILY be solved with my solution. If they were citizens, they would no longer keep costing the government so much money. MY solution is what is "best 4 the people". I have proved this various times, while you just continue to state why illegal immigration is a problem.

AS for your compromise, It is still to drastic. The least we change while still solving the proble, the least harmful side-effects it will have on society (Deportation is not for everyone…ask your doctor about deportation to see if it's right for you, side-effects may include nausea, coughing, diarrhea, vomiting, drowsiness…). I do not see wqhy we can't turn them into citizens WHILE THEY ARE HERE."

RepublicanView333: "Hello Harlan, B4 i start i would like to say this has been one of the more enjoyable debates I've done compared to some of my others. it was very intellectual and emotional, and I really enjoyed It I hope you did to.

Now your solution truely wouldn't do anything about the ones here. Its logic I'm talking from. B/c you didn't want to state the specifics of your solution all I know about it is it will make BECOMING a citizen easier. The ones here would continue being illegal and costing us money.

Now I don't like continuing to say this but It isn't revenge. Its a punishment. Like the death penalty or prison time. Is it revenge when we sent a bank robber or burglar to prison. Is it revenge when we lethally injected Micheal Ross for all the violent crimes He did. (Micheal Ross was a raper and killer of 8 woman. he was senteanced to death just a town over from where I lived). is that revenge or Justice. Now i'm sure you nor me have never nor will we ever see $789,263,000,000 but its ALOOOOOOOOT of money. If a group of people who aren't even citizens cost a whole country that much then they DESERVE to be punished.

How will we turn citizens into citizens put huts up in the street w/ a sign "All illegals come free citizenship"? Now that sounds a lot like Amnesty. Amnesty hasn't worked nor will it work w/ the ILLEGALS. you'll remember 1986 when the congress passed Amnesty to approximatly 3 MILLION illegals. In 20 (which on the timeline of the Earth is like 1 ) years we have 5 TIMES MORE illegals in our country. Amnesty hadn't work and i seriously doubt it will ...seriously

It may be horrible but it is the right thing to do. We as Americans can't take the chance to be a American away from a American (im speaking of the Anchor babies which illegal mommies will gve birth to on US soil to make sure there Americans) the parent when they gave birth knew if they were being sent back they might not have there Anchor baby. They knew the consequences and they made the risk. if you don't like the orphanages being filled with Mexicano Anchor babies then send them back either or is good 4 me.

Once again I say to Deserve anything you have to work for it. Thats what is wrong with America these days. Everybody thinks they "deserve" everything on a silver platter but don't want to work for it. Same w/ "deserving" a goodlife God bless those whos parents (who worked hard) money payes for everything and don't have to work a day in there life but at somepoint you have to earn it.

who cares if you never mentioned it. i never mentioned anything about "society" or "goverment being 4 the people" but you brought it up and I countered it.

Anyway. The Constitution doesn't cover everyone to walk the Earth. It covers Legal U.S. citizens. If Mexicans et al want to be covered by the Constitution they can apply LEGALLY and then be covered. Easy as that.

Now (im going to like this) you bug me for getting of topic but now you are. Luckily my arguemant is the last one but the debate is- Should-we-deport-all-illegal-immigrants-we-find-in-the-US not whos solution is better (oh i loved that) Now like i said b4 the Americans 2day are always looking 4 the easy way out. So what deporting illegals will take time and EFFORT but in american history whjat successes havent. Deporting is essential for getting illegals out and it is "Best 4 the people" Deporting will help decrease all the money the illegals cost. The money it will save will FAR out way the cost to deport.

Harlan i enjoyed this debate and I hope you did to. I learned some stuff and i hope you did too."